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NFL Countdown

Should Lions trade Suh?

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Should Lions trade Suh?





I love Suh. Love the way he plays, love his attitude. All that stuff.

But the Lions have to trade Suh and get out of that contract and cap hell. The Lions got fucked because they had 3 picks in the top 2 of the draft in 4 years.

Calvin Johnson 2007 (2nd)
Matthew Stafford 2009 (1st)
Ndamukong Suh 2010 (2nd)

All 3 of these players signed ridiculous contracts BEFORE the rookie cap. This is where it comes back to bite them. Megatron and Stafford have both signed extensions recently. Megatrons contract lasts until 2019. His deal will most likely get restructured in 2016 where his cap number balloons to $24 million. Staffords contract runs through 2017. I think a restructure gets done in 2016 as well when his cap number jumps to $22 million.

You have a Quarterback that is being overpaid because of the no cap era and you have the best WR in the league making the most of any WR in the league. The problem is, you can't have a top 10 quarter (in terms of contracts, Stafford is the 8th highest paid QB in the league) and the #1 paid WR in the league, along with Suhs inevitable top 5 defensive player contract.

For arguments sake, lets look at Geno Atkins contract, someone considered to be Suhs equal. Geno (who is 3rd in the league in DT contracts, behind Suh and Gerald McCoys rookie contracts) has a cap hit of $9-$10 million over the next 5 years. Suh has a base salary of $12,550,000 this year. For arguments sake, let's say that is what he will command for his next contract on a year to year basis.

As of right now, the Lions have $51 million committed to these three players in 2015 (Suhs 2015 is a voidable year) But if the Lions were to restructure Suhs contract, his cap next year would probably push that number up. Either way, the Lions have $51 of the projected $126 million cap, locked in three players. Not to mention contracts coming up for Joique Bell, Deandre Levy and Nick Fairley coming up, plus holes on the roster to fill.

This all comes down to money. Suh is a great player and brings a lot to the team, but the potential to improve in several key areas is really appealing, along with the ability to upgrade at weaker positions in the draft. If the Lions were to trade Suh, as some have suggested, for a 1st and 3rd round pick. The Lions would have $19,475,000 in dead money for 2014. Of course, that looks terrible when you are paying arguably the best defensive tackle in the league to play against you. But when you look at the cap relief that it gives the team it looks nice.

If the Lions do trade Suh, the Lions would go from (these are current numbers*) having $17,876,938 in cap space for 2015, up to $31,119,438. As well as upgrading at other positions with the extra draft picks.

At first I thought it was nuts. But when I started thinking about it. Do I want to keep a player here no matter what just because I like the guy, or do I want to finally get cap relief and be able to build a TEAM instead of having a couple super stars.

There are 2 options.

Option 1 is to restructure and extend Suh and have 3 star players all making star player money and having cap problems for the next 10 years.

or

Option 2, trade Suh take the immediate cap hit to get cap relief in upwards of $30 million AND get a couple draft picks in the process.

Option 2 looks pretty good if we want to build a winner.

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Should Lions trade Suh? :: Comments

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Post on February 15th 2014, 3:06 pm  EPICxPENGUIN69

Keep him. He will get a restructured deal and you guys will have 4 really good D-lineman next year and build around that.

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Post on February 15th 2014, 4:27 pm  BaltRavensFan20

Problem with trading him is, wouldn't you get top draft picks for him, and be in the same boat in a few years when those players you drafted with those top picks are asking for money?

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Post on February 15th 2014, 4:30 pm  EPICxPENGUIN69

BaltRavensFan20 wrote:Problem with trading him is, wouldn't you get top draft picks for him, and be in the same boat in a few years when those players you drafted with those top picks are asking for money?

interesting questions since Matt Millen is no longer there. You actually have guys you draft make it past the 1st contract before getting out of the league.

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Post on February 15th 2014, 4:36 pm  BaltRavensFan20

EPICxPENGUIN69 wrote:
BaltRavensFan20 wrote:Problem with trading him is, wouldn't you get top draft picks for him, and be in the same boat in a few years when those players you drafted with those top picks are asking for money?

interesting questions since Matt Millen is no longer there. You actually have guys you draft make it past the 1st contract before getting out of the league.

Yeah I mean, I don't usually hear of teams say, "hey, we are trading our top DT to clear CAP space, we will take lower round picks for him". The only thing the lions could do would be get top round picks and trade back for more picks.

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Post on February 15th 2014, 5:52 pm  MaddMatter

BaltRavensFan20 wrote:Problem with trading him is, wouldn't you get top draft picks for him, and be in the same boat in a few years when those players you drafted with those top picks are asking for money?

You said it yourself. PlayerS over PlayeR

There are 2 points to it.

1. With those draft picks we would be able to dilute the talent across the field. If this was the Pro Bowl draft and you had the first four picks, you wouldn't pick 4 QB's would you? No you would pick a QB, Lineman, RB, WR.

So instead of having 4 really good Dlineman, maybe we have 2 really good lineman, a really good LB and a really good safety. Instead of having 4 good dlineman and a shit secondary.

2. There's a good chance those players will never demand the amount of money Suh would, because it's unlikely that they will become the best player at their position.

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Post on February 15th 2014, 6:24 pm  Willbacker

There's really a lot to it. If they trade him to another team that team is gonna have to assume around 13 mil in base salary and then you just know he's gonna want to hold out his 2nd year of the contract only making 3 mil in base. He'd probally hold out on the Lions too. Lol. Restructuring is probally out of the question. That would just screw your cap in 2015. Extension might be the answer but again you'll be hit later down the road. The good thing about high draft choices is there's a reasonable cap which is why people are trading for these high picks.

I'd talk to the Raiders or Browns since both are gonna have a lot of cap space. If the Raiders I'd think you'd only be able to get their 1st pick(5th ovr) but the Browns it's either their top 1st or their 2nd 1st and other picks. I'd say it's time to unload him if they can find a trade partner. Then you'd have some serious ammunition to take either two topflight players in the 1st or trade for extra picks. Man you guys sure had your top picks at the wrong time. Lol.

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Post on February 15th 2014, 6:41 pm  BaltRavensFan20

MaddMatter wrote:
BaltRavensFan20 wrote:Problem with trading him is, wouldn't you get top draft picks for him, and be in the same boat in a few years when those players you drafted with those top picks are asking for money?

You said it yourself. PlayerS over PlayeR

There are 2 points to it.

1. With those draft picks we would be able to dilute the talent across the field. If this was the Pro Bowl draft and you had the first four picks, you wouldn't pick 4 QB's would you? No you would pick a QB, Lineman, RB, WR.

So instead of having 4 really good Dlineman, maybe we have 2 really good lineman, a really good LB and a really good safety. Instead of having 4 good dlineman and a shit secondary.

2. There's a good chance those players will never demand the amount of money Suh would, because it's unlikely that they will become the best player at their position.

True, what I was talking about more was, say the lions were offered a top 10 first round pick, along with say, a 3rd round pick. That top 10 pick could still demand possibly a large amount of money a few years down the road, so wouldn't that essentially place them in the same spot as they are now? I mean, then again, by the time that happens, Megatron could retire so that only leaves you with Stafford that is costing a lot.

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Post on February 15th 2014, 6:59 pm  MaddMatter

Willbacker wrote:There's really a lot to it. If they trade him to another team that team is gonna have to assume around 13 mil in base salary and then you just know he's gonna want to hold out his 2nd year of the contract only making 3 mil in base. He'd probally hold out on the Lions too. Lol. Restructuring is probally out of the question. That would just screw your cap in 2015. Extension might be the answer but again you'll be hit later down the road. The good thing about high draft choices is there's a reasonable cap which is why people are trading for these high picks.

I'd talk to the Raiders or Browns since both are gonna have a lot of cap space. If the Raiders I'd think you'd only be able to get their 1st pick(5th ovr) but the Browns it's either their top 1st or their 2nd 1st and other picks. I'd say it's time to unload him if they can find a trade partner. Then you'd have some serious ammunition to take either two topflight players in the 1st or trade for extra picks. Man you guys sure had your top picks at the wrong time. Lol.

Browns got a pretty good DT right now, don't know his name, but I know he's damn good.

Like you said, you would have to give him an extension. I don't think the Raiders would want to trade away that 5th pick. I see the Bills have a lot of cap space next year, I know they have Marcell Darrius (sp?) but he should be close to the end of his rookie deal right? Plus Schwartzis there, maybe a reunion? Colts and Dolphins also have a shit ton of cap room this year. Jets maybe? Redskins.

I don't know. It would be interesting. But I don't think the Lions would do it.

Oh and Balt, figure the first round picks get a 5 year deal. By the end of the 5 year, if Calvin doesn't restructure, his cap number drops to $17 and $18 in 2018 and 2019. So that frees up a little bit more.

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Post on February 15th 2014, 7:21 pm  BaltRavensFan20

MaddMatter wrote:
Willbacker wrote:There's really a lot to it. If they trade him to another team that team is gonna have to assume around 13 mil in base salary and then you just know he's gonna want to hold out his 2nd year of the contract only making 3 mil in base. He'd probally hold out on the Lions too. Lol. Restructuring is probally out of the question. That would just screw your cap in 2015. Extension might be the answer but again you'll be hit later down the road. The good thing about high draft choices is there's a reasonable cap which is why people are trading for these high picks.

I'd talk to the Raiders or Browns since both are gonna have a lot of cap space. If the Raiders I'd think you'd only be able to get their 1st pick(5th ovr) but the Browns it's either their top 1st or their 2nd 1st and other picks. I'd say it's time to unload him if they can find a trade partner. Then you'd have some serious ammunition to take either two topflight players in the 1st or trade for extra picks. Man you guys sure had your top picks at the wrong time. Lol.

Browns got a pretty good DT right now, don't know his name, but I know he's damn good.

Like you said, you would have to give him an extension. I don't think the Raiders would want to trade away that 5th pick. I see the Bills have a lot of cap space next year, I know they have Marcell Darrius (sp?) but he should be close to the end of his rookie deal right? Plus Schwartzis there, maybe a reunion? Colts and Dolphins also have a shit ton of cap room this year. Jets maybe? Redskins.

I don't know. It would be interesting. But I don't think the Lions would do it.

Oh and Balt, figure the first round picks get a 5 year deal. By the end of the 5 year, if Calvin doesn't restructure, his cap number drops to $17 and $18 in 2018 and 2019. So that frees up a little bit more.  


Ahh ok, yeah that makes more sense now.

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Post on February 15th 2014, 8:00 pm  Willbacker

MaddMatter wrote:
Willbacker wrote:There's really a lot to it. If they trade him to another team that team is gonna have to assume around 13 mil in base salary and then you just know he's gonna want to hold out his 2nd year of the contract only making 3 mil in base. He'd probally hold out on the Lions too. Lol. Restructuring is probally out of the question. That would just screw your cap in 2015. Extension might be the answer but again you'll be hit later down the road. The good thing about high draft choices is there's a reasonable cap which is why people are trading for these high picks.

I'd talk to the Raiders or Browns since both are gonna have a lot of cap space. If the Raiders I'd think you'd only be able to get their 1st pick(5th ovr) but the Browns it's either their top 1st or their 2nd 1st and other picks. I'd say it's time to unload him if they can find a trade partner. Then you'd have some serious ammunition to take either two topflight players in the 1st or trade for extra picks. Man you guys sure had your top picks at the wrong time. Lol.

Browns got a pretty good DT right now, don't know his name, but I know he's damn good.

Like you said, you would have to give him an extension. I don't think the Raiders would want to trade away that 5th pick. I see the Bills have a lot of cap space next year, I know they have Marcell Darrius (sp?) but he should be close to the end of his rookie deal right? Plus Schwartzis there, maybe a reunion? Colts and Dolphins also have a shit ton of cap room this year. Jets maybe? Redskins.

I don't know. It would be interesting. But I don't think the Lions would do it.

Oh and Balt, figure the first round picks get a 5 year deal. By the end of the 5 year, if Calvin doesn't restructure, his cap number drops to $17 and $18 in 2018 and 2019. So that frees up a little bit more.  

You're thinking of Phil Taylor. I probally shouldn't have mentioned the Browns cuz they run the 3-4. Your best trade partner should probally run a 4-3 base. Colts don't have a 1st rd pick but the Fish could be a sweet trade partner.

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Post on February 16th 2014, 5:22 am  MaddMatter

MaddMatter wrote:
As of right now, the Lions have $51 million committed to these three players in 2015

For comparison purposes. The Broncos, with Peyton Manning, have $38.5 million against the cap (to their top 3 players, Manning, Clady and Kuper) in the 2015 season. Stafford is no where near Peyton. Nor is the Lions team close to the Broncos team.

Manning is the #5 paid QB
Clady is the #3 paid Left Tackle
Kuper is the #20 paid Guard

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Post on February 16th 2014, 3:42 pm  HurpDurpHurray

What would you get for Suh though? Like you said, he has a big contract. Add on the negative attention he gets and the fact that DT isn't exactly a major position, I just don't see you getting much return. Maybe if it's the trade deadline you'll get better value but I just don't know if trading him would be worth it

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Post on May 26th 2014, 3:25 am  MaddMatter

Anyone hear what Suh said this week? I'm starting to think we're gonna lose Suh no matter what. Fuck it, clears up cap space and we still have Ziggy So I won't be upset if Suh is gone next season. Nor will I root against him, unless he signs with Chicago.

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Post on May 26th 2014, 2:28 pm  MASTRxOFxPUPPETZ

MaddMatter wrote:Anyone hear what Suh said this week? I'm starting to think we're gonna lose Suh no matter what. Fuck it, clears up cap space and we still have Ziggy So I won't be upset if Suh is gone next season. Nor will I root against him, unless he signs with Chicago.

who would trade for Suh with a 23 million dollar Cap hit?...personally I think Suh is a really good DT but 23 million? thats just way to much, i didint even realize he was making that much, i thought he was in the 11-12 million range, heres the Lions cap, its gonna be hard to even sign their 1st round pick..

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Post on May 26th 2014, 3:15 pm  EPICxPENGUIN69

well the raiders, bengals, and jacksonville have a fuck load of cap space

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Post on May 26th 2014, 4:06 pm  MaddMatter

MASTRxOFxPUPPETZ wrote:
MaddMatter wrote:Anyone hear what Suh said this week? I'm starting to think we're gonna lose Suh no matter what. Fuck it, clears up cap space and we still have Ziggy So I won't be upset if Suh is gone next season. Nor will I root against him, unless he signs with Chicago.

who would trade for Suh with a 23 million dollar Cap hit?...personally I think Suh is a really good DT but 23 million? thats just way to much, i didint even realize he was making that much, i thought he was in the 11-12 million range, heres the Lions cap, its gonna be hard to even sign their 1st round pick..

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His cap number is ridiculous because of the restructurings and signing bonuses. I think his "real" cap number is closer to $10, it's just ballooned up to $23 because of those bonuses. Even if the Lions traded him they would still have a $20 million cap hit.


I just don't think he's going to be back after his rookie deal is up.

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Post on May 26th 2014, 4:22 pm  MASTRxOFxPUPPETZ

MaddMatter wrote:
MASTRxOFxPUPPETZ wrote:
MaddMatter wrote:Anyone hear what Suh said this week? I'm starting to think we're gonna lose Suh no matter what. Fuck it, clears up cap space and we still have Ziggy So I won't be upset if Suh is gone next season. Nor will I root against him, unless he signs with Chicago.

who would trade for Suh with a 23 million dollar Cap hit?...personally I think Suh is a really good DT but 23 million? thats just way to much, i didint even realize he was making that much, i thought he was in the 11-12 million range, heres the Lions cap, its gonna be hard to even sign their 1st round pick..

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His cap number is ridiculous because of the restructurings and signing bonuses. I think his "real" cap number is closer to $10, it's just ballooned up to $23 because of those bonuses. Even if the Lions traded him they would still have a $20 million cap hit.


I just don't think he's going to be back after his rookie deal is up.

the Link i put up shows his cap hit at 22+ million, but your right its because of all the bonuses gaurenteed money etc etc, the Lions are actually spending a little over 12 million this year for him and even if hes traded or cut they would owe him the 22+ million..thats a lot of clams

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Post on May 26th 2014, 10:02 pm  Willbacker

MASTRxOFxPUPPETZ wrote:
MaddMatter wrote:
MASTRxOFxPUPPETZ wrote:
MaddMatter wrote:Anyone hear what Suh said this week? I'm starting to think we're gonna lose Suh no matter what. Fuck it, clears up cap space and we still have Ziggy So I won't be upset if Suh is gone next season. Nor will I root against him, unless he signs with Chicago.

who would trade for Suh with a 23 million dollar Cap hit?...personally I think Suh is a really good DT but 23 million? thats just way to much, i didint even realize he was making that much, i thought he was in the 11-12 million range, heres the Lions cap, its gonna be hard to even sign their 1st round pick..

[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]

His cap number is ridiculous because of the restructurings and signing bonuses. I think his "real" cap number is closer to $10, it's just ballooned up to $23 because of those bonuses. Even if the Lions traded him they would still have a $20 million cap hit.


I just don't think he's going to be back after his rookie deal is up.

the Link i put up shows his cap hit at 22+ million, but your right its because of all the bonuses gaurenteed money etc etc, the Lions are actually spending a little over 12 million this year for him and even if hes traded or cut they would owe him the 22+ million..thats a lot of clams

According to over the cap.com(if you guys don't use this site as your salary structures you oughta check it out) Suh is owed around 22 mil this year and next year 13 mil. Trading him or releasing him will save 3 mil total this year which is definitely worth thinking about seeing that his best year was his rookie year. I just want to know what he said cuz I haven't heard a thing.

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